AMX 50 Foch
|Revision as of 23:49, 11 May 2019|
Added "no stock grind" and penetration issues
|Revision as of 23:50, 11 May 2019|
|Line 12:||Line 12:|
|* Very weak side/rear/roof armor even with the buff in update 9.20, large weakspots negate the frontal protection||* Very weak side/rear/roof armor even with the buff in update 9.20, large weakspots negate the frontal protection|
|?||* Lowest per-shot alpha of any Tier 9 tank destroyer (tied with the Tortoise) and mediocre penetration for role; ||+||* Lowest per-shot alpha of any Tier 9 tank destroyer (tied with the Tortoise) and mediocre penetration for role; APCR|
|* The gun is a better handling version of the Tier 8 and underwhelming across the board for that Tier increase vs. competition||* The gun is a better handling version of the Tier 8 and underwhelming across the board for that Tier increase vs. competition|
Revision as of 23:50, 11 May 2019
AMX 50 Foch
Mouse over "
[Client Values; Actual values in
|15501550 HP Hit Points|
|50.2/59.5650.18/62.56 t Weight Limit|
- Commander (Radio Operator)
|8501000 hp Engine Power|
|50/13 km/h Speed Limit|
|2628 deg/s Traverse|
|16.9319.93 hp/t Power/Wt Ratio|
|180/70/40 mm Hull Armor|
|400/400/515400/400/515 HP Damage|
|257/325/65257/325/65 mm Penetration|
▲5.83 Rate of Fire
Click here for more information.
Click here for more information.
Click here for more information.
▲2616 Damage Per Minute
With 50% Crew: 0.434 m
With 50% Crew: 0.434 m
|s 2.5 s 2.5 Aim time|
|2626 deg/s Gun Traverse Speed|
|20° Gun Arc|
|-6°/+18°-6°/+18° Elevation Arc|
|6868 rounds Ammo Capacity|
|2015 % Chance of Fire|
|m 380 m 380 View Range|
|m 400 m 750 Signal Range|
- Stationary: 14%
- When Moving: 8.6%
- When Firing: 4%
- On Hard Ground: 1.25
- On Medium Ground: 1.34
- On Soft Ground: 2.3
Dispersion Change Values
- Turret Contribution
- Rotation: 0.19
- Shot Recoil: 3.84
- Suspension Contribution
- Acceleration: 0.19
- Turning: 0.19
With 100% Crew
From the late 1940s to the early 1950s, France was developing heavy tank destroyers. This project was developed under the influence of German tank destroyers of WWII. The vehicle featured a 120-mm gun. At least one prototype was built, which took part in the military parade in Paris on July 14, 1950. Never saw mass production.
A progressive update of the AC Mle 46 and 48, the 50 Foch continues to follow the 'all-or-nothing' trend by focusing all its effective armor and firepower into a narrow frontal arc. It has thicker frontal armor than the AC 48, and is also rid of the useless anti-aircraft turret that the AC 48 is cursed with. The aim time of the 120 mm gun is also much improved with a somewhat higher rate of fire. Unfortunately, it still shares many of the same weaknesses that the AC 48 had, and the 120 mm gun is underwhelming at Tier 9, especially since many heavy tanks at that tier get similar guns. In general, the Foch has suffered from power-creep at the higher tiers, to the point where it can be considered the worst Tier 9 tank destroyer in the game.
The AMX 50 Foch leads to the AMX 50 Foch B.
Modules / Available Equipment and Consumables
|Rate of fire
|X||120 mm AC SA46||257/325/65||400/400/515||5.83||0.35||2.5||3580||339000|
|Chance of Fire on Impact
|IX||Maybach HL 295||850||20||750||78000|
|VIII||AMX 50 Foch||59.56||26||0||11000||27650|
|IX||AMX 50 Foch bis||62.56||28||0||11000||64000|
Pros and Cons
- Very strong frontal hull plate that is immune to most regular AP rounds at normal angles
- Accurate gun with significantly improved handling compared to the AC 48 while retaining autoloader
- Good maximum straight-line speed with good acceleration, can keep up with some mediums and reposition well
- Low profile with fairly decent camouflage values
- No stock grind, top engine and suspension aren't needed
- Very weak side/rear/roof armor even with the buff in update 9.20, large weakspots negate the frontal protection
- Lowest per-shot alpha of any Tier 9 tank destroyer (tied with the Tortoise) and mediocre penetration for role; needs APCR
- The gun is a better handling version of the Tier 8 and underwhelming across the board for that Tier increase vs. competition
The Foch is heavily dependent on being able to snipe from medium to long distances or flanking unsuspecting enemies. It is an extremely difficult tank to play at close ranges due to its length, middling traverse speed, and prominent weakspots that negate its otherwise excellent armor: the ever-present rangefinder and turret on top of the French tank destroyers. These must be exposed whenever the Foch has to open fire at an enemy, and the only real thing a player can do to counter this is to wiggle the tank and hope for a lucky miss or ricochet. For similar reasons, fighting on hilly terrain is highly not recommended in the Foch unless there is no other option. The low HP pool does not help in this respect either. The absolutely horrible armor on the sides, rear, and top make it very vulnerable to flanking attacks and artillery hits are devastating to the Foch.
The firepower of the Foch is by far its greatest weakness, the 120 mm SA 46 being the only gun option. While a very powerful gun at Tier 8 on the AC 48, the gun is very weak for a tank destroyer at Tier 9. It has by far the lowest damage per shell of any Tier 9 tank destroyer gun, tied only with the Tortoise. However, while the Tortoise has a phenomenal rate-of-fire to compensate for this (among the best damage-per-minute values of any tank in the game), the Foch has no such consolation. With barely over half the shell damage of the T30 or Object 704, the Foch must expose itself to repeatedly shoot an enemy. The disappointing damage output means it needs to land at least two shots from a clip to justify the trade, when opponents can fire and (should) retreat to avoid those follow-ups. The terrible gun dispersion values make it absolutely hopeless at snapshotting enemies, although the aim time is significantly better than on the AC 48. The penetration is acceptable enough under most circumstances, but can be frustrating when combined with the Foch's horrible dispersion values.
That said, the Foch does boast good speed and acceleration, which does allow it to reach aggressive forward positions or keep up with medium tanks, if one prefers to live dangerously. However, it has only slightly better hull traverse than the Object 704, and if a fast medium or light tank gets on the side or behind a Foch, it is game over. It absolutely requires support to cover its flanks if played aggressively.
When allowed to play as a medium/long range sniper, the Foch can also perform decently, as it becomes much harder to hit the weakspots and the armor becomes more effective. The gun is also quite accurate once fully aimed, and it can hit fairly reliably at long distances. It also has decent camouflage values and view range, making it harder to spot. In this respect, it plays similarly to the SU-122-54, which has a far greater damage output and agility, while the Foch has much better frontal armor and a more accurate gun at long ranges.
Overall, the Foch is a difficult tank destroyer to play aggressively, and can be a frustrating experience, especially to a less experienced player. But, then again, if you have made it this far up the French tank destroyer tree, you should not be surprised by this, right?
- Nothing much to research except for the upgrade suspension and upgrade engine (which is shared with the AMX 50 120)
- Stock suspension can handle a lot of weight, therefore engine > track.
The M 4 closely resembled the German King Tiger in general form, though the turret was to be made of welded sections; but to limit the weight to a desired thirty metric tonnes the proportions were rather smaller and the armor had a maximum of just thirty millimeters. Like the later German tanks of the war it had, in this case eight, overlapping road wheels. Part of the project was to study whether a modern torsion bar suspension should be used or the height lowered by ten centimeters through a fitting of leaf or coil springs.
Two prototypes of the M 4 were ordered. The Army soon indicated that a protection level of thirty millimeters was unacceptably low. In response armor was increased. To save weight it was decided to install a novel oscillating turret, designed by FAMH. Nevertheless, when the first prototype, now named the AMX 50 after its intended weight class, was delivered in 1949, it weighed 53.7 metric tonnes. In the winter of 1950 instead of the 90 mm, a 100 mm gun was fitted, designed by the Arsenal de Tarbes. The second prototype with a slightly different turret, but also with a 100 mm gun, was ready soon after. The prototypes had a length, with gun, of 10.43, a width of 3.40 and a height of 3.41 meters. It was intended to fit a 1200 hp engine to attain a speed much superior to all existing medium tank types. The Maybach HL 295 (a redesigned German gas engine in 1945 captured at Friedrichshafen by Engineer-General Joseph Molinié) and a Saurer diesel engine were tested. Both failed to deliver the required output and maximum speed was in fact no higher than 51 km/h. The prototypes were tested between 1950 and 1952.
Based on the M 4 chassis in 1950, AMX presented a prototype of a heavy tank destroyer in the form of a 120 mm self-propelled gun, the Canon Automoteur AMX 50 Foch, named after Marshal Ferdinand Foch. It was intended to give long range fire support to the medium/heavy AMX 50 100 mm model. The design had a lot of similarities with German Jagdpanther tank destroyer. It had a long bareled 120 mm gun with a muzzle break attached to a well sloped and heavily armored flat profile vehicle. Remotely controlled anti-aircraft machinegun was placed on the right side of the roof, while commander’s cupola with the range finder was pushed to the left.Unlike previous post war concepts like the Mle. 1948, several AMX 50 TDs were built, the first in 1950. Field tests were promising, and army started to prepare to adopt AMX 50 Foch in small numbers. When AMX engineers managed to install a 120 mm gun into an oscillating turret of the AMX 50 120 tank, Foch immediately become obsolete and all further development and production were stopped.
Historical Accuracy Errata
* The Foch was never designed to hold an autoloader